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Y6 Multirotor

Discussion about custom airframe designs

Y6 Multirotor

Postby DanZ » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:48 pm

Hey Guys
 
So I'm sure like most of you my brain never stops thinking about multirotors, I'm always thinking about "what next" and that for me at the moment is a Y6 AP platform. I love the look of a Y6 and from what I have read about them so far on a few forums they seem to be good choice for AP.
 
So here is my Proposed Y6 Config
 
Frame DIY
6 x MT2214-11 710KV
1 x Nanotech 5000mah 4s 1p
6 x HK F-30A SimonK ESC's
3 x 13x4 APC E-Prop (Top motors)
3 x 13x6.5 APC E-Prop (Bottom motors)
 
As for weight I estimate the frame to come in at around 500-600g with a payload of probably no more than 650g (Point and shoot camera +
baisc 2-axis gimbal). So what I have spec'd above is a bit of an overkill, but it will allow some head room when upgrading the gimbal and camera down the line. I could even for now use some 3s batteries I have lying around, they should still give enough lift. The only thing I have to buy are the motors and props, everything else required I already own. But the motors are pricey... Depending on funds I might initially test the frame using some RCtimer 2836-880 KV motors that I have (they have seen better days though).
 
As for the different pitched props that I have spec'd, I am just going on hearsay from various other Y6 users. The aim is to try increase overall efficiency by having a higher pitched prop underneath as they are robbed some air flow from the props above. Anyone have experience with the APC E-props? My local hobby shop has a big range of E-Props but no real suitable slow flyers. I must say the one of the most appealing aspects of a Y6 is not having to rely on reverse pitched propellers.
 
So let me know what you guys think as well as provide any advice regarding the setup if you have built one yourselves or a similar rig.
 
Dan
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Re: Y6 Multirotor

Postby robone » Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:51 pm

DanZ wrote: 
As for the different pitched props that I have spec'd, I am just going on hearsay from various other Y6 users. The aim is to try increase overall efficiency by having a higher pitched prop underneath as they are robbed some air flow from the props above. Anyone have experience with the APC E-props? My local hobby shop has a big range of E-Props but no real suitable slow flyers. I must say the one of the most appealing aspects of a Y6 is not having to rely on reverse pitched propellers.


Hi Dan

I haven't built a Y6 yet, but I have built a X8. Principles are almost the same.

From what I know, ideally the bottom motors should have one size smaller props.

You also say that you do not need Pusher props. Not sure about this,with all the FC's I have used, as far as I know all of them have the Pusher props at the bottom. The lower props are reversed on the motor so the leading edge is facing upwards and they also turn clockwise, so you need Pusher props.

screenshot.46.jpg
screenshot.46.jpg (14.94 KiB) Viewed 5327 times


If you want, usually the local hobby shop has 12x3.8 and also 11x4.7, and I can get them and ship them to you.

Cheers
Rob
http://www.multirotor.co.za
| 3DRobotics | ZeroUAV | RC Tiger Motors | Vulcan SkyHook Airframes |
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Re: Y6 Multirotor

Postby DanZ » Mon Jul 23, 2012 6:28 pm

Ahhhhh, I checked the mixer settings again, you are right about the props :( Silly mistake on my part. But at least it still opens up some new possibilities as all the top props spin one direction and the bottom all spin another. If and when I need the props Rob I'll take you up on that offer, the 12x3.8 and 11x4.7 sounds like a good combination.
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Re: Y6 Multirotor

Postby Andre » Sun Jul 29, 2012 8:40 pm

On my y6 i used to have the 12 3.8 on top and the 11 4.7 on bot and what i have found its a bit less eff like i have now 11 4.7 all round. On a 5800 mah 4s and with a auw off around 2.2kg and avroto motors witch is the same as the t motors 770 kv you can get about 13 min flight time.

For ap work get the groupner cf 11x5 props bit exspensive. If you want to carry weight stiff propsis a must some people even recomend wooden props.
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Re: Y6 Multirotor

Postby topview » Fri Nov 02, 2012 1:35 pm

I was looking at this airframe as opposed to the x 650, i simply went with the x650 because in my mind the survivability with a motor off would be greater with the hex, well at least to my mind, does anyone have any experience with this. From what i have seen with a engine out on a hex is not the energy required to keep it flying but the rotational forces caused by the imballance in left and right torque which causes the problem, you end up with only two props to counteract the torque of three so the thing starts spinning horizontally, so in effect the controller needs to shut down a second engine or equivalent torque from all three motors running in the opposite direction to the failed motor, well that is my theory anyway.
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Re: Y6 Multirotor

Postby DanZ » Fri Nov 02, 2012 1:50 pm

I don't have any first hand experience with which is more redundant. However your assumption of how the controller would react if you were to loose a motor or prop on a hex is correct (well at least for my OP FC it is). It would shut down the opposite motor so as to balance the yaw and keep it stable, basically turning it into a quad. So in order for this to work, it obviously need to be able to support it's weight on only 4 motors.
The reason I think a Y6 would offer better redudancy is because instead of shutting down a motor to balance the yaw, I would imagine the FC would try to work the two remaining opposite running motors harder to stabilize the yaw and therefore you wouldn't loose as much lift. Why I think the 3 v 2 scenario in this case would work is because of the motors be co-axial and counter rotating direcly underneath one another :hmmm:
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Re: Y6 Multirotor

Postby robone » Fri Nov 02, 2012 2:05 pm

topview wrote:I was looking at this airframe as opposed to the x 650, i simply went with the x650 because in my mind the survivability with a motor off would be greater with the hex, well at least to my mind, does anyone have any experience with this. From what i have seen with a engine out on a hex is not the energy required to keep it flying but the rotational forces caused by the imballance in left and right torque which causes the problem, you end up with only two props to counteract the torque of three so the thing starts spinning horizontally, so in effect the controller needs to shut down a second engine or equivalent torque from all three motors running in the opposite direction to the failed motor, well that is my theory anyway.


It depends a lot on the on the Flight Controller and how it handles the situation, and whether the AUW can be carried by the remaining motors. Each FC is different, as to how they handle managing the remaining motors. However, if you are carrying a heavy camera and the multirotor is designed just to carry that load and one motor/prop/ESC goes, you are in trouble.

I have seen a video of Hexa fly with 1 and 2 motors disconnected, in a controlled environment, however, what happens when a motor or prop goes in the air is anyone's guess. I have seen a video of X8 break a lower prop while flying and take out the higher prop and lose all its "in built" redundancy.

The Y6 or X8 are supposed to have more redundancy than a Octo or hexa. The quad has none. The Y6 and X8 handle wind conditions better. I have found that if you do not leave sufficient space between the tips of your props in a Hexa, it starts to act like a wing/kite and is severely effected by the wind.

Rob
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